Gina Khan lives in Birmingham's Ward End. She is a British Muslim and has spoken out in the past about the problems she and her community face from extreme Islamists. Described as "a very brave woman" in an article for the London Times, Gina - in a four part exclusive interview given to the Westminster Journal - here, in part three, continues to relate her experience as a British Muslim and calls out, especially to the British Government, for help in solving the Islamist problem the West is now experiencing from within.  

Q: What do you of the think of the 7/7, 21/7 and Glasgow bombers?

When I watched 3000 people die within 30 minutes on 11th September 2001, I was horrified and the first thought that came into my mind was, "My God, they have started the war''.

For me, after reading the anti west, anti American flyers and posters in the 90s, watching the rise of a backward Islam, it came as no surprise that America was attacked. In fact I thought it would be Britain first. At the time I was unaware that the same ideology, network and strategic planning that the Jihadists and their mentors were implementing was international.

I had already imagined a suicide bomber walking into a British night club or shopping centre planning to commit mass murder in the name of Islam. I was always taught your life belongs to God, He alone knows when your time is up so to take your own life a huge sin.

My Mum used to teach me as a kid that to stamp and kill an ant is a sin, all living creatures belong to God. Such simple, meaningful teachings of the Prophet and God's wisdom kept my faith going.

These men on 9/11, 7/7 and 21/7 believed they are the soldiers of Islam. Amazing. They lived in the 21st century with the mindset of the 7th century. They are fools.

In 2001 on the al Jazeera channel, Osama Bin Laden stated '' We( meaning Jihadists) love death as much as you in America ( or infidels) love life.'' Hence this has become the rhetoric Jihadists adhere to. They believe they are on a mission as martyrs for the revival of a Caliphate, they believe they are dying for their beliefs and their religion.

If you have ever studied Osama Bin Laden or even people like Moazzam Begg from Birmingham, you will observe that they use the Quran, certain verses related to the historical events of Jihad in the Quran and twist verses to suit their ideology .

Q: You knew Moazzam Begg from Bimingham?

Moazzam Begg was in Guantanamo. He was a local turned mujahid who was once a member of a Birmingham gang called the Links alongside Shahid Butt (during the 90s Butt was arrested in Yemen for planning a bombing and there are videos of him around sitting next to Abu Hamza and appeard on Dispatches ranting as any Jihadist would).

The civil rights lawyer (this seems a contradictory term for her) Salma Yacoob fought for their release. When I look and see what they are doing to Birmingham now I wonder why they were ever let out.

After being released from Yemen in the 90's Shahid Butt still roams free in Birmingham as a mujahid, while Moazzam Begg is still preaching from the Quran on British TV about the 'Ummah'' and attempts to mobilise Muslims using extreme interpretations. He claims all Muslims all over the world are all from one body of Islam - a huge myth that needs to be dispelled. These guys embarrass me and the majority of British Muslims. Their notion is for Muslims to discredit the countries they are born in and join their 'ummah' to revive political Islam to revive a Caliphate. Similar attempts and doctrines are used by Hizb ut Tahrir. There is no 'ummah' anymore.

Q: So you are not part of this ‘Ummah'?

For Muslims like me I prefer to read the last message the Prophet gave to his people in reference to the society and community he ruled. The 'Ummah' is a powerful myth. It comes from the root word 'motherland' and the only motherland I have and would stand up for is my country, Britain.

Even if there was this exaggerated 'ummah' and a Muslim deferred from their nationality, Islamists would disable half the body of Islam by reversing the rights of women as they have done in Afghanistan or Iran. This reversal was also attempted in Pakistan by General Zia to reverse the freedoms and rights of Pakistani women in the 80s who engaged with Islamists. And for anyone who wants to debate me then read Maududi's version on Human Rights in Islam. He avoids the issues regarding equality of minorities and Muslim women.

Q: Women round here (Ward End) look like they think they are part of the Ummah?

I don't believe that wearing a ninja outfit will protect any Muslim woman against rape or sexual harassment. In the Quran it only states that ''The believing woman should cover her bosoms and private parts '' and most women in the world do that anyway. There is no 'true Islam ' to return to unless they are going to totally reject western modernity and ship in camels as well.

Osama bin Laden didn't create this ideology, the ideology created him. Syed Qutb, Maududi , Al Wahab to name a few were inspired by the 13th century scholar Ibn Tammiya who badly distorted Islam and attempted to shut down Muslims' thinking and reasoning. That's another great myth the Butts and Beggs can't get a grip on. They can't shut down women's thinking or independent reasoning, or that of the majority of Muslims in general. No Islamic ummah will protect any woman. Women need a reality check if they believe that.

Q: How best to combat the Islamist ideology round here?

It's because of these "mujahideen" and the Islamists who have a voice in Britain today (why? Oh government, please wake up and help us out here!) Muslims have to re interpret the Quran again in the 21st century. I am in no denial that there are verses that discriminate against minorities, women or the infidel. Fund more modern women to become Imams. It.is not against the preachings of the Prophet for women to lead Friday prayers or teach pluralist Islam. Lets debate the Islamists who claim to represent this 'true Islam'.

Ex Hizb ut Tahrir member Hassan Butt clearly stated in the media ''that until Muslims acknowledge the violent streaks in the Quran, nothing will change.'' And he is right because those are the edicts that Islamists and Jihadists perpetrate to mobilise our minds. Osama Bin Laden swears by the Quran on video that he is not lying, and I'm telling you he is not lying. The Quran gives two messages and we as Muslims have a choice which message we want to adhere to. If the Quran speaks of war, it also speaks of peace. The Prophet Mohammed states in the Quran that ''there is no compulsion in Islam, difference of opinion in my community is a manifestation of divine mercy''. You wouldn't get any Islamists mention that passage in the Quran. They suppress the spiritual message of the Holy Quran. They have managed to establish their extreme version of Islam into the West because of imported, distorted translations and imported imams who can dynamically quote the Quran. Hence we tend to rely on them for the interpretation of the Quran.

With respect to the old historical Jihads, well those wars were similar to the biblical wars. These men fought face to face on battlefields, the Prophet had set principles in war; that women, children and the elderly must not be killed. So when it suits Islamists they reject what the Prophet preached and they transgress international laws. Islamists, be they Salafists, Wahhabists, Khomeinists, twist verses of the Quran reading it off into the present century as timeless, quoting historical edicts and interpretations that have not only hijacked the religion but blacklisted the name of Allah and Mohammed round the globe. These are not men you can sit around a table and negotiate with like the IRA. Jihadists won't even coexist with other reformed or moderate schools of thought. It is a supremacist ideology - it's their way or the highway.

Q: What about the suicide bombing ideology?

These suicide bombers are not 'martyrs'. They are brainwashed (like my Dad became), become brain-dead and then used as pawns in this modern Jihad. These human bombs blow themselves up as well as innocent bystanders - it's a pathetic human carnage. They don't care what religion, race, gender or age we are. How can this just be a Muslim problem? It's criminality not religiosity.

We need to collectively oppose this ideology and name the ideology as Jihad. It is jihad. Osama's Jihad is a unholy war. Secular, modern Muslims in the 21st century with even half a brain know that and we must break the Islamists' silence to oppose it. It's no good repeating Islam means peace because we have been blacklisted as a religion globally thanks to their perverse and dangerous version of Islam.

For Muslims and non Muslims to feel secure in opposing this ideology there must be a law against Jihadism as there is for racism or Nazism - one that works on a community level. Jihadists' literature must be challenged and opposed - better just pulped.

Politics must be kept out of mosques and the likes of Dr Nassem in Birmingham must be forced into retirement. His politics and views are dinosaur-like to the great majority of Muslims. We - British Muslims - are not being victimised (though victimisation is a key Islamist strategy). The whole world is being victimised here by this extreme violent ideology that uses Islam as its doctrine.

If you don't challenge the interpretations intertwined with the oppressive theology thrust upon Muslim women, you cannot defeat the enemy. I don't see how they (the British Government) can defeat the ideology in Birmingham Sunni mosques by handing them half a million pounds to eradicate radicalism when no one has even banned the anti west, anti gay, criminal edicts on minorities or apostles, or books on the War on Islam - when this country gave us full freedom to practice and worship our religion. We were never under attack for our religion until Jihadists and Islamists sent their human bombs to attack innocent bystanders.

This war should be renamed clearly as the war on modern Islamism. Muslims don't have a Caliph, no-one authorised Osama Bin Laden to advocate and start Jihad. If the War is against the West then it's a war against British secular Muslims too - that means we Muslims in the west and our children will not be spared. When will Muslims understand that? No ‘ummah' or silly veil can save us if Osama manages his recruits, while we allow Muslim leaders and Islamists to play down the threat. Gordon Brown can only mobilise the mind of the public by better defining the ideology and hopefully he can get his act together - he must understand that the solutions are mainstream even when the subject matter is not. They now know the name of this global ideology so they have to show some backbone.

Millions and millions of Muslims, in Saudi Arabia especially, cannot claim to understand the Quran word for word. It is a complex Arabic language that has been preserved but is not spoken even by today's Arabs. A beautiful language has now been turned into ugly aggressive tones by members of Hizb ut Tahrir, Anjem Choudhary, Shahid Butt, Abdu Abdullah.  They use theology and politics. The suicide bomber's mind is indoctrinated with all these mens' misinterpretations to subtract the fear of death.

This war isn't just a militant war; it must be against the ideological intellectual Jihadists, Islamists, Imams and organizations who plant the seeds of Jihadism into the minds of Muslims.

Q: In Ward End this war is hard to escape?

My son was approached by dynamic Islamists in Ward End. It was only because I had told him to be vigilant that he recognised their motives. These areas lack facilities and youth centres for the youth to access. Whatever sport centres there are, are dominated by sporty mullahs. Women/girls have to go into non Muslim areas or wait for specific women's' programmes.  And yet there are mosques, mini mosques every few yards. Difficult to escape them - that's how the Islamists want it. You know the Tablighi pride themselves from spending days inside mosques?!  They sleep, exercise and eat in there?

I observed many mosques that are empty all day except on a Friday afternoon. Most serve no purpose at all to women and children or to non Muslims in the community unless you're seeking conversion..

There are book shops where the wrong interpretation is being promoted, I have dozens of books I collected myself in the 90s when I was in search of my religion. Now in hindsight I realise I too could have been indoctrinated. I was pretty depressed back then, searching for peace of mind. I could have easily fallen into this trap.

Q: And in schools?

I read the book Islam Beliefs and Teachings by Ghulam Sarwar. (Ed Husain pointed him out in his book -The Islamist). The first few chapters of Sarwar's book are devoted to the 5 pillars of Islam. He then goes on to discussions and questions on political Islam and Sharia law (which is outdated and was actually initiated by Caliphs not subscribed by Allah or the Prophet in any form), the status of Muslim women and our rights (which is less about rights and more about our duties) and he praises the "great" Islamic states of Iran and Sudan (lovely places?!).

Sarwar's ideas and teachings have been infiltrating British Education in Muslim communities (communities with high concentrations of Muslims) since 1966. These books were aimed at Muslims like me born here. Written in English.

"How do we create an Islamic State?" Sarwar asks the children. He tries to compare Sharia law with 'man made laws' but gives no indication what Sharia law will implement in his vision of a Islamic State. "A Muslim's happiest occasion in life is to see the Rule of Allah established on earth'', he writes. I don't think so - ask the women of Pakistan, Iran, Sudan, and Afghanistan (countries which are living hellholes for Muslim women). Ask Muslim women here in Britain - Somalians, Iranians or even Pakistani women. Would they dare go back as lone mothers ??

These writers - so called scholars and Imams - are indoctrinating our children and as mothers we exert the most power over our children in shaping their minds. We should pulp all these books. Question their ulterior motives and interpretations. We must educate our children against extreme versions and promote the values and principles of our democracy. The problem with Britain is that it still wants to hang onto the history of guilt regarding colonialism and imperialism. Today if India is a successful democracy in Asia, it's because it teaches it's young generation to love and respect it's Motherland. We spend too much time putting this country down instead of promoting our values and principles as a nation. There might be a high rate of teenage pregnancies in the west but at least you guys don't murder you daughters and you don't reject an illegitimate child. Muslim girls have been murdered and the 'bastard' child is stigmatised and abandoned. What kind of God would want that as justice for mankind ?

Q: Mothers should be teaching their kids that suicide bombing and Islamism are wrong?

Absolutely..These Islamists are every modern Muslim mother's nightmare, in fact many non Muslim mothers are very concerned. I would urge Muslims to reject political Islam outright. It's a myth that Islam and politics are one theology. How do I know that? Well millions of Muslims have lived in the West without a Caliph or Sharia law and lived as secular Muslims whether they use that term to define themselves or not. Millions of Muslims in countries like Turkey, Egypt and Tunisia aspire to democracy and reject Sharia laws as being outdated. It doesn't mean they are not Muslims. It means we evolved as Muslim People too. Men like Jinnah and Bhutto and Ghandi Ji studied in Britain and took back the tenets of Democracy to their countries.

Jihadism emerges and opposes the tenets of democracy. If women are fighting for the soul of Pakistan which is what Benazir Bhutto was hoping to implement, then why are we as British Asian Muslim women participating in our own oppression by remaining silent thinking someone else is going to come along and create change? We should let our feelings cascade down onto our kids.

We all have a moral duty to create change and condemn the suicide bombers as pure evil and unIslamic. We need to get our facts right. They have targeted Muslims born in the west for over 40 years, with their interpretations and indoctrinations on satellite tv, through cds, books. We have to hit back too. So I believe this war will last a minimum of 40 years, silence won't get us anywhere.

Q: The ideology won't just fizzle out even if the Islamists are cracked down on by the government?

Even if Osama bin Laden was arrested or shot dead, the ideology will create another Osama Bin Laden aspiring to be the revived Caliph or Mahdi. Sitting in caves and creating massacres, murdering Muslims who convert or women who seek freedom, assassinating activists and reformers who stand up for their natural rights. Islam does not give Islamists authority over matters of life and death. They will continue to unleash their violence to instil fear into the masses. They want to create this clash of civilizations and anti west propaganda but there's only one civilisation and they're not part of it. They have studied the weaknesses of the countries they want to target and they use our democracy to pursue their own distorted Islamic agendas. MCB are a good example. They should never have been nominated to be the voice of British Islam. Dr Bari should be concerned about the poor people of his own motherland instead of getting on the nerves of British people who don't believe in arrange marriages and don't have to conform to their 'Islamic' ideas. It's bad enough for Muslim women that they advocate our ‘status' without consulting us.

They shut down debates. I 'd like to see more debates on the veil , on the so called status and rights of women that Maududi interpreted. Muslim women all over the world fight to free themselves from oppression and abuse, while these leaders are writing Muslim manifestos for our school children without consulting with any of us. They are taking us step by step backwards and manipulating the positioning of being British and Muslims. 

What gets me are the likes of Anjem Choudary. If this war wasn't so dangerous I would have laughed at his rants. He lives with a 7th century mindset, believes in Sharia law, and demonises the west and democracy so why is he still here practising as a solicitor?? They are hypocrites -it's an easy life for them here either way and they are the last people to sacrifice the easy way.

 Interviewed by WJ 

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